Here are the current standings:
1. 3.5 GM Magnus Carlsen (Norway 2690)
2-3. 3.0 GM Viswanathan Anand (India 2779), GM Levon Aronian (Armenia 2744)
4-6 2.5 GM Vassily Ivanchuk (Ukraine 2750), GM Peter Leko (Hungary 2749), GM Peter Svidler (Russia 2728)
7-8 1.5 GM Alexander Morozevich (Russia 2741), GM Veselin Topalov (Bulgaria 2783)
Do you think Topalov is playing too much chess? Should he be cutting back on his schedule?
Chess Daily News from Susan Polgar
Topalov needs to either cut down on the quantity of tournaments, or allow himself to agree to occasional draws. Fans may not like it, but people like Svidler and Kramnik seem to be fully aware of the limits of their nerves and health, while Topalov charges ahead like a bull (which he is not).
Let us look at the evidence. On ICC today someone said that the players are up on a high big stage. There is a lot of theatre light on the players and they can not see the audience well.
Therefore Morelia is a natural place where players can not see the audience. Now let us look at the performance last year.
After 6 rounds last year Topalov had 2 points. I could not find it after 7 rounds. Anyway look at this year. Topalov has 1.5 points after 5 rounds.
This is circumstantial evidence. not absolute evidence. but the circumstances now point that Topalov does not play well in a venue where he cannot see the audience.
Last year when he returned to Linares where the players can see the audience, he raised his total from 2/6 to 8/14. Again circumstantial evidence that says Topalov performance is very high when he can see the audience.
More evidence to come as each tournament unfolds. Hopefully Linares will not allow the players to see the audience this year.
Susan is very honest. And I know Susan wants to see tournaments run where the participants can not easily cheat. I am in favor of the same good honest chess games.
At Corus where the audience almost sits in the players seats, Topalov crushed Magnus with perfect fritz moves. I watched the game. His moves were perfect. Now in Morelia, Topalov kept missing the opportunities. Reviewing the 2 games, Topalov played them very very differently. More circumstantial evidence. It keep piling up. It all points in one direction.
Bye the way, nice play by Magnus. He kept missing the computer moves but he won in the end. He took a lot of risks and it worked this time.
Topalov is not playing too much chess. His computer can keep turning out moves with no problems. He just needs tournamets where he can easily see the audience. Danailov said they can be ready to play for the World Championship they only need 2 days to get to Moscow. Sure their computer does not need to study. Ha Ha.
Go Carlsen, go!!
The previous post is the most ridiculous one I ever read in my life.
after 6 rounds last year.
http://www.chessbase.com/newsdetail.asp?newsid=2944
End of Linares last year
http://www.chessbase.com/newsdetail.asp?newsid=2974
http://www.chessbase.com/newsdetail.asp?newsid=2949
report after 7 rounds all games in Morelia last year.
Topalov was -3
he ended the tournament at +2
so he must have played +5 in Linares.
Strange behavior. He plays so strong when he can see Danailov and plays so weak when he can not see Danailov. The evidence is adding up.
I’m still in shock at Topalov’s resignation — it’s on a par with Kasparov’s infamous resignation in game 2 of the 1997 match with Deep Blue.
I’m not much into conspiracy theories about Topalov and Danailov, but I think it would be a good idea if Danailov would stay out of the playing hall for a few tournaments in order to settle the rumours.
Topalov doesnt cheat.
He just doesnt play well in Mexico!!
Topalov’s strange collapses are not necessarily signs of cheating. Look at Morozevich and Ivanchuk. They can win or lose without any obvious reason. Those who gamble a lot, also lose a lot. Kramnik and Leko remain solid because they never take such risks. But fans tend not to like such solidity, prefer fireworks. This time the fireworks worked for Carlsen.
“I’m still in shock at Topalov’s resignation — it’s on a par with Kasparov’s infamous resignation in game 2 of the 1997 match with Deep Blue.”
How strong are you? He loses a piece…
Let us look at the evidence. On ICC today someone said that the players are up on a high big stage. There is a lot of theatre light on the players and they can not see the audience well.
—-
Great post, very well analysed.
Good for Carlsen, shame on Topalov!
Nice blogg from Carlsen’s dad and manager here:
http://blog.magnuschess.com/
what is going on here? Why does he resign from that position? something stinks
What stinks is that TOPALOV has very little chess ability, especially the endgame, without the help of DANAILOV and DEEP FRITZ.
Only a PATZER would resign here and this is what TOPALOV has been all along.
What will they do now maybe claim MAGNUS went to the bathroom too many times. I can’t wait for the book to come out!
From reading posts here I don’t believe in progress anymore. Who sad that people are sheep? Well said.
Be patient chess fans! Wait until 3-4 super tournaments again before we make any judgement.
I hope audience will be blocked from Players in every tournament. Even in that circumstances I believe Topalov will be back in his form.
Remember he is in pressure also to prove that he is not cheating.This is just a bad day, that’s all.
But if he still bad in 3-4 tournaments after this, then I will start to hesitate on him.
Topalov should cut back on his schedule by retiring rather than falling back to his true rating of around ~2730. That would be humiliating for topalov and bad for chess.
“But if he still bad in 3-4 tournaments after this, then I will start to hesitate on him. “
Robert,
Those tournaments should be played under conditions such that players can not see spectators. Banning managers from the playing venue does not solve the problem. It is not so difficult to find someone else who will pass the signals to “the” player using body language.
The Polgar sisters are definitely
pro Topalov !
“Is Topalov playing too much chess ?” It sounds like Topalov himself is giving an excuse.
In 2005 after the WCC in San Luis
Judith said : “Nobody talks of Kramnik any more”…quite a bad prophecy.
Kramnik of course is less spectacular, but by far more intelligent.
His famous blunder against Fritz is completely different from Topalov’s blunder now, because Kramnik didn’t see it (literally),
while Topalov blunders rather often because he doesn’t understand !
Anyone who has been playing chess for two months or so understands a mate in one, but it can happen you don’t see it because of absent-mindedness or fatigue.
The fact that Susan didn’t spell out this difference, looks suspicious to me.
Nicolaas
Hello,
tournaments without public like a football match on empty stadium.:-(.
I think that no possibility to see the public could decrease the motivation of some players. Players are like acteurs, are playing for the public, they need to have contact with the public. If there is no public in theatre what the point to play.
The presence of some people and eye contact with them could help in psychological way, when you see the friend around you feel better, it has nothing to cheating.
Such a speculations of cheating are stupid.
Regards
Pony
It is ridiculous to accuse Topalov of cheating under all circumstances.
a) Topalov Plays Badly, Danilov in Audience -> Misread Signalling
b) Topalov Plays Well, Danilov in Audience -> Signalling Sucessful
c) Topalov Plays Badly, Danilov isnt in Audience -> No Signalling hence Topalov unable to win.
d) Topalov Play Well, Danilov isnt in Audience -> Topalov got Lucky.
Clearly its a no win situation for Topalov.. whether he wins or loses.
So let me state this clearly.
“Topalov isnt a Cheater. Kramnik is”
Carlsen is evil ! from chessbase :
“Topalov with a sensational resignation in a position that must be a draw. In fact Carflsen shows the horrified former world champion the defence immediately after he had resigned. Now the 16-year-old Norwegian once again leads the field.”
I hope a video exists. Should be funny to watch.
“Clearly its a no win situation for Topalov.. whether he wins or loses.
So let me state this clearly.
“Topalov isnt a Cheater. Kramnik is”
Great logic Anonymous 3:04.
It seems like Topalov fans are as dumb as Topalov.
It’s wonderful to see that Magnus Carlsen is still improving. After Corus, lots of people said that he’s not good enough for these tournaments, but now he seems to have taken another big step in his development.
Topalov had 2750 in 1996 and was number 3 of the world (after Kasparov, Karpov).
In 1996 fritz (or any other comercial chess program) was definetly not that strong. Also Topalov then droped .(did fritz droped?)
Also in Elista there was a glass between players and audience. Topalov lost marginally (-1) from the player (Kramnink) that beat Kasparov in a match and most people say he is the best match player.
All these prove that Topalov is certainly very very good player, without any fritz help, and definetly the fact that he resigned that game only proves that he is now out of form.
Having fritz as help, may increase his strength which is WELL KNOWN TO BE VERY GOOD. AT LEAST 2730 say, which obviously does not explain the so far performance. No one (with some minimum intelligence) claims that Topalov is a patcher that uses fritz to become number one. Some accuse him for using computer help to become from number 5,6 in the world (2730), to number 1 in another level 2800.
This means that all arguments here, about him being unable to see a forced perpetuate, as evidence he was cheating, are simply stupid.
Just wait for the book – you’ll see the truth. I’m now reading it and it’s absolutely awesome! Hope it will be translated and published in your languages soon…
A bulgarian GREAT fan of Topa :))
TO PETROV >>>>
Topalov is a 2700 level player no 2800 after think 5 minutes and not being able to find simple draw line is not something because of being OUT OF FORM! Topalov is very weak in the endgame, this is another shame for his blunder reportoire!!!
Would everyone please stop accusing Susan of siding with Topalov because of the style of her comments? If she just accuses Topalov without very solid facts, everyone would be justified to suspect her neutrality. If Topalov really is cheating, some day solid facts will come out, and only at that stage will Susan be able to call Topalov a cheat. Her giving him the benefit of the doubt now would make her eventual cheating accusation even stronger, that is, if he really is cheating.
Actually, the perceived bias in favour of Topalov may be interpreted as her actually being suspicious of Topalov. She is leaning as far as possible in his favour to strengthen her eventual accusations.
57f6
Those of you who are attacking GM Topalov’s character are behaving in a petty and disgraceful manner.
You should be ashamed to say that such a great player cheated. Your comments are only indicative of your own spiteful nature, and you ought to have the grace and maturity by now to apologise for your tasteless and utterly fruitless, hate-filled remarks.
If you liked chess really, then you would appreciate Topalov as a brilliant, imaginative and interesting player, and this allegation nonsense would mean nothing to you.
I am not ‘attacking’ Topalov, but indeed the cheating evidence gets clearer and clearer…
Whenever he cannot see the audience, he plays badly…
Weird, no?
Cheating or not – it’s impossible to know, and we will not know… What is sure is that when someone had a too dirty behaviour, the organizers should absolutely not accept him any more in the tournament building (to try to stop all rumours). This is for Danailov: How is it possible the organizers accepted him in Corus?
I’m not close from Topalov level (I’ m about 2200 FIDE), but I don’t believe having a few (limited) information during a game from some computer analysis, more or less well understood by somebody who would be 400 elo lower than me, would be of any help for me.
I will loose more (time, and game understanding) trying to find some rationale behind these information, than it will bring advantages…
To properly analyse (post-mortem) my games I often need several hours for one single move in a critical position, to get closer from the “truth”, even with computer help.
This is even more applicable for 2700+ players…
Thus I do not believe Danailov can help Topalov. Only a very strong IGM (and probably only a team of several) with computer support could provide any useful information.
Any I believe any strong player would understand this quite well..
All this Danailov signals issue is just some psychological battle…
Stephane
Well, cheating or not. I think Topalov has done us all a favor by putting attention to this problem. He probably didn’t intend all the focus to be on himself, but atleast people are taking it seriously now.
I also think that no matter what has happened before, Topalovs (possible) cheating days are over. A snowball has a better chance at surviving in hell than Toppy has at cheating in any near future (and probably for the rest of his career). Everybody will be following him and Danailov very closely.
-esben
This is good news for chess. Let the New York Times do a chess article about Magnus Carlsen. Better yet, Sports Illustrated. Here is this adorable kid who plays soccer and tennis in between rounds instead of these weird guys with obvious personality disorders.
TO ELLOT:
How stupid can you be? Do you think that is natural for 2700 to blunder but not for a 2800? You think that this blunder show anything about ending understanding? You definetly have around 1400 at max 🙂
Also, the mate in 1 that Kramnink blundered means he is so weak in tactics?? Come on!
By the way it is Petros and not Petrov.. (not a Bulgarian my friend. just rational:)
I don’t think you can draw any conclusions just because one guy blundered at the end of a 7 hour game. More likely the reverse, Topalov hasn’t paid enough attention to chess lately. He’s been too focused on making excuses for his defeat in Elista. Time to move on.
“At Corus where the audience almost sits in the players seats, Topalov crushed Magnus with perfect fritz moves”
Nonsense. Topalov’s moves in this game vary from Fritz a great deal. In fact, none of the conspiracy theory nuts have been able to match an exact engine match to Topalov’s moves.
Similarly, the famous ‘evidence’ video is from Round 11, Corus 2006. Ivanchuk-Topalov 1/2-1/2.
Dr Kenneth Regan’s analysis of the games proves that the anti-Topalov tinfoil hat brigade need to get more.
“So let me state this clearly.
“Topalov isnt a Cheater. Kramnik is”
Let me state this clearly, too: You just gave everyone a license to attack Topalov.
That’s an incredibly stupid thing to do.
Topalov needs to play more chess. He needs more serious practice. He has to learn how to plan and evaluate positions.
Topalov could ask Magnus to be his chess coach. With a good coach Topalov might be able to improve.
In Morelia the players are in contact with the audience. But they simply can not see them well. They are on a theatre stage. Here are some pictures. Look for the pictures that show the playing setup.
http://www.chessbase.com/newsdetail.asp?newsid=3678
and there is an excellent picture here.
http://www.chessbase.com/newsdetail.asp?newsid=3685
Certainly the audience can watch the entire tournament easily. The audience is in the dark and the stage is bright lights that fill the eyes. So it is not easy to see the audience clearly.
Can we please forget the cheat accusations and concentrate on the chess. The cheat aspect has been done to death from all angles aimed at (mostly) two players. Unless someone comes up with some clear cut proof, lets move on and talk about chess not cheating. I am getting that way I can’t be bothered reading any blog postings relating to Topalov or Kramnik.
>>Can we please forget the cheat accusations and concentrate on the chess.>>
Maybe. If Topalov apologized for his role in all this and admit he was wrong to accuse without real evidence, it would take a lot of the steam out of his attackers. Don’t look for that, though. He’s got books to sell. So he’ll have to lie in the bed that he made in the meantime.
Well, if Topalov plays too much chess, what is Carlsen doing then? He plays more tournaments than any of these other guys.
>>> Anonymous said…
Cheating or not – it’s impossible to know, and we will not know… What is sure is that when someone had a too dirty behaviour, the organizers should absolutely not accept him any more in the tournament building (to try to stop all rumours). This is for Danailov: How is it possible the organizers accepted him in Corus?
>>>
Why do they allow Danailov in Corus?
Very simple. Danailov is the organizer of the new World Grand Slam system. Corus is a part of that. To not allow Danailov they really need to have solid proof against him. There is this huge conflict of interest here. In the Grand Slam system basically Danailov is a partner with those who run Corus. You can not slap your partner in the face without super strong evidence.
I have another interesting observation. Here is how I think it works. And thus computer analysis of all the moves will never show a fit to a computer.
First you want to develop as complex a position as possible on the board. One where the tension is huge and lots of different moves to consider. The computer is good at this and the human is not good at this.
Now I can beat anyone if I get this position. I can sacrifice the exchange etc. Whatever I want. My sacrifice does not have to be solid. It only has to make the board very complex.
Now I get my moves from the computer so I want these positions. My opponent does not get his moves from the computer. His chances of making the best move are very very low. Tal basically used this strategy. Now with the computer program Topalov can get all his moves “perfect” and just wait for the mistake. The follow up will again be perfect and the audience loves the game.
Now let us observe that in Morelia, Topalov has not produced a complex position even once. He plays regular careful chess. But when Danailov is in the audience in Corus then Topalov plays these wild positions and crushes his opponents.
Let us take a look at Topalov Magnus from Corus. Topalov plays a mess that does not match a computer. He plays an exchange sacrifice and then plays perfect computer moves. The really most suspicious move of the game is the very last move of the game. That move is not a human move but a computer move. Topalov played it without much thought. Just enough time for the computer to settle on that move and relay it.
you can review the game here
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1448157
The final move is h4. now the chess board offers lots of approaches of how to proceed. h4 seems like an unusual choice but it matches fritz9 perfectly. I watched it live with my fritz9 running.
I ran my fritz9 the entire game Magnus Topalov yesterday in Morelia. And Topalov was not matching Fritz9 moves at critical points and in general.
But in Corus after the sacrifice, Topalov was dead nuts on perfectly all the Fritz9 choices. So we could say he is a good player and could make the same moves as fritz but how come he could not do it last night in Morelia.
I have been watching all the Magnus games and not the Topalov games so I do not have analysis of Topalov games against other opponents.
It would be good if someone went over all the Topalov games from Morelia and Linares last year 2006 and verify if Topalov was playing wild positions in Linares +5/7 and quiet positions in Morelia -3/7. Also check if Topalov has made any grand sacrifices in Morelia this year. I dont think so. He is already -2 this year.
Simple computer analysis of all the moves of the games will reveal nothing. The analysis has to match the cheating technique. The technique is to only cheat on a few moves. So see how well Topalov matches out in very complex positions like after a sacrifice.
Even the absence of sacrifices in Morelia is interesting if true.
THE TRUTH IS GOING TO COME OUT.
Attacks on Susan for being pro-Topalov are ridiculous. Just like all of us have favorite players and personal preferences, so does she. Yes, it is obvious that she likes Topalov and rather dislikes Kramnik, but why is it bad? Has she ever claimed to be an angel or an objective judge?
Yes,
Susan pretends to be objective, and she believes she is.
I noted many times she is not, and there would be nothing wrong with it if she agrees on this.
Topalov and Kramnik are most notable examples of her subjectivity.
Also, I agree that Topalov not only plays better when he is visual touch with public. But this does not necessarily mean he is a cheater. He can be just an extravert, and needs a public to play well, as many theater stars do.
I don’t think Topalov is playing too much chess. I think Danailov is using too little cellphone
no no no.
I think Topalov is absolutely playing too much chess and Danailov using too little cellphone
I have seen photo’s from tournaments where Topalov has done very well. I keep noticing that during some of the games Topalov will have his hand in his pocket. Is he receiving signals from someone? Since I know they were scanned for electronic devices I have to conclude that he is actually cheating with a magic chess rock in his pocket. If you touch the rock while concentrating on the position the correct move will be revealed.
I won’t get into the LAN jack on the back of Kramnik’s head. It is very well hidden under his hair. He would go into the bathroom in Elista, splice that lan cabling running thru the ceiling and then just connect his own brain straight into a dual core PC running the latest version of Fritz.
I can’t believe the specious logic people use to claim that either Topalov or Kramnik are cheating.
“Simple computer analysis of all the moves of the games will reveal nothing. The analysis has to match the cheating technique. The technique is to only cheat on a few moves.”
Well…there’s a lot of truth in this theory! It is very true: take whatever position (well, not totally won or lost ones!) and let a computer play a few powermoves, from any side. It will get on top against humans! Even against strong GMs!
Yes, for sure in very mixed-up positions like you mention.
I can hardly believe there is cheating among GMs, but after all i’ve seen in Elista and all….you never know. With all respect, but this Bulgarian team plays it VERY dirty!! So you never know.
It is for sure clear that Topalov his top-form is over now, it seems….?
Weird indeed….he plays now like a 2700-2730
Perhaps his true strength…
Topalov is pushed by Danailov who wants to earn money .
It is more than obvious.
Another story concerning cheating problem:
Intresting case appeared during just finished Moscow Aeroflot Tournament, one, relately low rated player (2535) got 5 out of 6 in the main tournament, after that some of his opponents were suspisios about his possible cheating (computer style play, strange rhythm (timing) of the moves), after that organizers just canceled live translation of this player games. So he got just half out of 3 in the rst of tournaments.
sorry:
in the rest of tournament. Just only facts.
That is nothing to do with beating easier opponents in early rounds and then loosing to bigger dogs.(?)
If you beat Riazantsev and Korotylev you also must beat Alekseev and Jakovenko. (?)
Do you know what is the name of the player, or do you know more about him?
If I was a strong player (2535) and having the tournament of my life (5/6) at Aeroflot, I’d be feeling confident and good about myself.
Now if I am unjustly accused of cheating I would be angry and distracted and likely to sink to half out of 3.
So the drop in results is not confirmation of cheating at all.
Hi,
people are judging other people on the base of himselves…
It touches cheating either. All has started after San Louis. Some players
and reporters start accusations against GM Topalov. Do you remember who where there ? Were not the russian Morozevich or Kasmizanov. It has started from there. They are main responsible for that mess. May be somebody could analyse their games by computer. They are performing not good last time.
I do not think it can prove sth.
You can analyse the position by Hiarcs,Shredder etc which you want to get in the game then you are using ‘computer’ moves.
Regards
Pony
The name of the player is Stanislav
Novikov (born 1985).
Look at http://www.chessbase.com report of 22/02/2007 on the
Aeroflot Open : this article gives some information on Novikov. Not a word there on possible cheating. Where do these rumours come from ??
If you have followed russian chess you would know Jakovenko and Alekseev are much stronger players
than Riazantsev and Korotylev.
Jakovenko is on the way to crossing the 2700 barrier, Alekseev won the Russian Super Final and Aeroflot A1 tournament.
If the article on chessbase is trustworthy, I suspect the rumours grew out of frustration.
Jakovenko for instance was convinced he was winning but got only a draw because of perfect defending of Novikov.
Please indicate where I can find information on the web on this case of possible cheating ?!
Nicolaas
Might I add : young or less experienced players , when they
are in good form, often play well in the first part of the tournament
and tend to play worse at the end
(exhaustion, lack of experience with longer tournaments,…).
I’ve noticed this the last months.
Examples :
Vachier-Lagrave in Corus B
Nepomniachtchi in Corus C
Nyzhnyk (ukrainian “wonder child”)
in Aeroflot B
Nicolaas
Last add :
the same may happen with Carlsen
in Morelia Linares…
Who will say then he has been
cheating ?
Nic.
For example info from russian website (chesspro.ru), sorry for russian, short translatition:
Novikov got 5 out 6 with on-line translation, after that half out of 3 without, probably (not clear)even he byself asked to cancel his on-line due to cheating rumors, but some GMs (without names) certainly think that he cheated somehow. Conclusion: in any case we need to do something to stop rumors, the conditions of the top competitions have to be changed
Maks (I think its IM Maxim Notkin):
Будут вопросы – обращайтесь, я не всегда такой вредный.
vstorone:
Макс, а что за разговоры идут о недобросовестной игре Новикова?
Намеки на читерство…
Maks:
vstorone,
как Вы понимаете, про Новикова – тема деликатная, а у меня только куски информации – ритм игры и сила ходов показались соперникам подозрительными, Андрей Шустаев вроде бы сказал (не мне лично), что Новиков сам предложил ему, чтобы его партии не транслировали. Как-то так.
Pretendent, кмс (Russian Expert)
На закрытии я говорил с двумя гроссмейстерами-участниками Аэрофлота (понятно, фамилий называть не стану), у которых на этот счет сомнений не было. Сам я никакой информацией не располагаю, но вот факт: в первых 6 турах Новиков набрал 5 очков (пока его партии транслировались), после окончания трансляций – в трех турах набрал пол-очка. Возможно, это случайность. Но сами понимаете, время такое – любые сомнения трактуются в пользу обвинения))) Наверное, в будущем в серьезных (а может быть, и всяких) турнирах нужно какие-то детекторы устанавливать, что ли. Есть же у обычных спортсменов допинг-контроль. А у шахматистов, наверное, компьютеро-контроль…
thenewone (someone from Bulgaria)
Ну, на примере Новикова все можете увидеть как влияют на игре (и на ударе) подозрения в читерстве — концентрация не та, настрой не тот, вообще…
Думаете, Топалову не влияют?
Pretendent, кмс
Вот для этого и должна быть создана бесстрастная система проверки, для которой все равны – что Топалов, что Новиков. Как допинг-тест. Все спортсмены, скажем, могут быть уверены, что N принимал допинг, но если тест дает отрицательный результат, значит, человек чист. Сейчас в шахматах смутное время: проблема только что появилась и пока никак не решается. Найдут способ решить – все сомнения будут, как и положено, трактоваться в пользу обвиняемого :)) а пока…