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It looks ok. Nice vision.
Wow, Jim. 15 seconds? That’s awfully good! I looked at it for a long time and certainly didn’t follow it through for 13 moves. I would love to be able to do that at all, much less in 15 seconds.
But if 4…Kd6?
The White Bishop doesnt go to f5 with Tempo
doesnt matter really the rook on e8 is hanging and after rxe8 the queen has no where to go qd7 rd8. same idea.
yes in the end its Q+B vs B+R
jimmd you got that in 15 seconds you could beat Tal and Fischer simultaneously! Come on who are you fooling!! Unplug the fritz please!!!
Even with such material advantages, you need to continue your analysis and discover whether Black can somehow create a fortress or force into a drawish R vs Q end game. Obviously, with a bad bishop, so many pawns on the board, the closed nature of the position, and the possibility of pawn breaks on the kingside to promotion, this is not the case…
i saw Jim’s line but after 4…Kd6 black looked very safe (in my mind’s eye) and i could see no more checks!
now that i check with a computer, i do not believe a GM would solve this in 10-15 seconds (blitz speed) like JimMD.
obviously the correct conclusion to draw is: JimMD is a super GM.
b
1. Nf5 e6xN
2. Qh8+ Ke7
3. Re1+ Bxe1
4. Rxe1+ Kd7
5. Bxf5+ Kc6
6. Rxe8 Qd6
7. Re6 Qxe6
8. Bxe6 winning
(White needs to pay attention to Black’s managing to get in Be4+ followed by Rc1#, but this is not an immediate threat)
I now see that jimmd got the sequence just right, and in blitz time. Congratulations.
I did not solve it in 15 seconds. I simply looked at the position for 15 seconds to store it in my mind and was able to think about the position in my mind without looking at the diagram. It took me approximately 90 seconds – 2 minutes to solve it in my head without looking at the diagram. I should have stated that I suppose and apologize for the misunderstanding. However seeing that the immediate Qh8+ leads to nothing because the black king runs to d6 gives away the solution because in such positions if there is a combination it is the minor pieces which must lead the way. there is no checkmate so sacrificing too much material (rook or queen) would ultimately not be sufficiently conclusive. In your mind you only look at the sacrifice to get key squares, open lines. Here the first move Nf5+ opens the e-line as well as the h3-c8 diagonal. The trajectory of these lines if you draw an “X” allows three of white’s pieces (bishop on c2, rook on d1, rook on h1 to enter the attack. So immediately if you can give up one piece to allow three of your pieces to work together it should become a candidate move in your mind “at least”. So in my mind 1.Qh8+ was the first move i evaluated and after seeing that with black king on d6 white could no longer proceed to a decisive conclusion (because none of white’s pieces can aid the white queen in the assault) It became clear to me that a temporary sacrifice of material was needed to open the e-file for the rook. My first thought was that if I can control these black squares (d6 and e7) that the Black king would have nowhere to run. I quickly saw in my mind’s eye that Nf5 threatens mate and black is forced to capture and also quickly realized that my bishop on c2 could now play a role when and if the king goes to d7 and also realized that a Rook check on e1 would be a double attack against the rook on e8 and knew the king had to protect e8 from d7 and that Bxf5+ makes it impossible to protect the rook from d7. from there I thought to myself well it is even material after i take on e8 Rde1 Bxe1 just being a temporary sacrifice that a strong tactical chessplayer has no problem foreseeing because he knows that he will have a rook playing a role on e1 after the exchange. weaker tactical players struggle when forced to give up so much material to try to make ends meet because they are always worried about material. Here as white you should only be worried about the black king escaping. Once i saw that material was even I also foresaw that attacking the queen with the rook after Rxe8 would gain a tempo against the black queen “giving me another tempo” for my attack so when I started to think where is the black queen going to run it became obvious to me that it was limited in mobility and only had the d6 square to go to note the trajectory path of the rook on e8 and bishop on f5 as i mentioned earlier. and of course the meeting point of this trajectory path is e6! so finding re6 was instanteously spotted by my board vision. This really was not complicated to see….everything was forcing even from move 1 because mate is threatened. I am no GM but i have made sincere efforts to improve board vision and calculation abilities by understanding pattern recognition, tactical themes, and i really feel like that there is some things missing in books on tactics. Ive seen some material years ago about the trajectory paths that i spoke about. GM Alon Greenfeld spoke about this in his mini-lectures on kasparovchess.com, of which Susan’s sister Sophia was a part of. I learned a lot about chess from this site and it is all very avid to my mind. but really if i would have kept sight of the diagram I am sure that I would have solved this in no more than 30 seconds because of the forcing nature of the knight sacrifice which opens two different lines to the white pieces. I have some material on tactics that I would like to share…..that I think can be useful to players that I have not seen in any books to be honest. Susan has a nice book on tactical themes (shall i know because it was a gift to me from her)that gives very good example positions and base understanding. I tried to solve these positions in my mind instead of looking at the diagram. There is some techniques you can use to improve board vision. But patter recognition is something you have to work on and work hard. you need to see tactical elements of a position very quickly because in chess we sometimes miss what we do not intuitively discover when analyzing a position in our mind. pattern recognition is a big part of intuition.
i wonder how long it would take Susan to solve this? and for her to explain her thoughts as they run thru her mind. There is an excellent book written by Jacob Aagard I believe called Inside the Chess Mind, where he gives a test of certain positions to different Grandmasters and asks them to explain exactly how they were thinking about each position after so many minutes of equal thought. I have not read it yet but briefly glanced at it and was very impressed by the work. I will read it soon enough. i have even thought about taking the test myself before reading the book to compare my thoughts with those of the masters.
it is not a mating attack but a positional advantage by sacrificing the Knight to f5… forcing the move exf5, Qh8+…Ke7, gRe1+…Kd6, Rxe8…resign
f5
Hi Jimmd,
I greatly appreciated your explanation, and personally i understand that you first look at the position, and then resolve it i your your mind. Working like this is really good (blind-chess) because your are not disturbed by the pieces on the board.
I would like to take contact with you and speak aout your method of working tactics.
You can contact me wia my blog:
http://www.chess-mind.blogspot.com and live comment or your e-mail there for example. I will translate our discussion for the frenchs readers !
Thanks
I spotted 1.Nf5 within 2 secs maybe but had a hard time to visualize the following sequence so it took me about a minute.
i have a quote, see what you think of it:
“never trust anonymous person on internet”
that advice can save your life, esp if you have pics on myspace.
i point out a few things:
1.Jim specifies which rook goes to e1, and it’s the SAME rook the computer chooses. it makes no difference, so why bother to specify which rook?? huh???? b/c the computer notation specifies. in fact Jim’s whole line matches the computer line EXACTLY.
2.no mention of 4…Kd6, a very “human” looking alternative
3.the self-congratulating language, “i only look for 10 seconds”
4.saying “whether i’m right or wrong” after copying the computer line, knowing it is right
5.the rambling, long, very defensive reply
6.anonymous, see rule above.
you didn’t fool me, Jim! i hope youre not MY doctor! or even my barber or grocery checker.
BTW, i beat you all– i solved before diagram was completely downloaded.
‘Chad in the Arizona Desert said…
Wow, Jim. 15 seconds? That’s awfully good! I looked at it for a long time and certainly didn’t follow it through for 13 moves. I would love to be able to do that at all, much less in 15 seconds.
‘
Nf5 was the first move that came up to my mind… let’s say 1 second to find that one and about 20 to detrmine that it could be the solution. I’m only 2350…… So why cant someone else do the same?
The more I think of it the more I am convinced that any 2700+ player (blitz, ICC) would be able do do this in equal or less than my 20 seconds…
My appologies if anyone construed my comment as a “dig” against JimMD. That was not my intention. I really was impressed with his resolution and also with his later explaination. I am just getting in to playing chess and am amazed how some can see so deep into a problem like this.
1. Bf5
Thanks guys for the reassuring comments. I didn’t take anything from your comment but kindness chad so no worries :). i will visit your site guillaume. I enjoy commenting here. Ive always enjoyed talking to chessplayers, i think because I live so far from other chessplayers and tournaments (about 2 hours from baltimore, pittsburgh, DC) that when I am able to discuss chess sometimes I get too excited 🙂 Geez, good thing i didnt mention i won a big prize in the world open in one of the sections or anonymous would have put me in the computer category along with people like Steve Rosenberg for example :). I just had not played tournament chess (other than maybe 1 or 2 tourneys) in 3-4 years. While my chess strength grew my rating remained, im not a sandbagger that’s for sure. But during this 3-4 years If I worked so hard at improving my game, should I not be rewarded ? To me winning some money at world open, does not even come close to compensate for the hours I put into this game….believe me. It was very encouraging process to win such a prize at the tournament and made me feel like all of my hard work paid off. But one has to be careful to recognize that in chess hard work sometimes does not pay off…particularly if the work is self-guided without aid of a strong player. I know this all too well. most of the puzzles on Susan’s site I do not even comment on….but enjoy reading other players thoughts, because i want to teach chess, and its all about understanding the error in your student’s thought process and evaluating these thoughts quickly and explaining to them exactly what there error is. Sometimes a chessplayer is put before them a position like this one for example in which they know there is a combination of moves that will win but only because it is obvious…why would a person post a position unless there is a concrete conclusion from that particular position of that game. However, believe me correctly assessing a chess position and finding its solution is of course very beneficial in practicing your pattern recognition, tactical sight, calculating ability, but equally helpful is looking at the position and its remnants (pawn structure, piece placement, opp-side castling…same side, open files….which pieces have been exchanged…..and trying to investigate in your mind a reasonable understanding of how this position came about. after all in chess when we play a tournament game the little chess fairy doesnt fly over our board and say hey you got a combination here. I personally believe its only by understanding such details is it possible to really really improve at chess. so in your studies of tactics i hope you will take this into consideration and would love to hear some feedback about it. could anyone here venture to guess maybe what opening this position might arisen from ? opp side castling…half open e-file….open c-file. bishop on b7, c2, the advanced position of the pawns and pieces on white’s queenside and likewise on black’s kingside particularly pawns on a3 and g6. i believe this investigation is just as interesting as the solution to the position itself. what do you guys think ?
@jimmd – your comments are very exhaustive and funny but not very helpful – i wonder why …???
we in germany have a saying – it sounds:
nur getroffene hunde bellen
engl.: if the shoe fits, wear it (hope i got it right)
^^
Ya, Germany has another saying, “We Surrender.”
Did that one translate alright for you?
The World Open is a pathetic tournament that begs for cheating. I never understood why a 1300 noob should win $10.000 it just asks for cheating and/or sandbagging.
As for the people winning those prices and BRAGGING about it disgusts me even more. Stupid noobs who think they are God (or they feel the need to write a book – de la maza?!) just because they won a Noob tournament.
Got the message JimMD?
P.s I said that most 2700+ (ICC blitz) players would be ale to solve it that quick, I never doubted that you used a comp or lied about the time used.
Americans are so full of themselves, you need to be more humble to succeed in chess!
And the current world-open form is deadly to American chess. We have thousands of people preparing by playing blitz and avoiding otb rated game to win that big prize. JIMmd is even proud about this…. go figure
I agree with anonymous. Chess players should be humble quiet people, like Zen-priests, to reach an acceptable level.
lol @ we surrender. ok ok u guys need to calm down 🙂 keep it on chess plz 🙂
“Americans are so full of themselves, you need to be more humble to succeed in chess!”
Oh BS…what has that got to do with playing over the board!
Play up or shut up!
1. Nf5 (threatens mate)
2. … exf5 (forced)
3. QRe1 (seals off all escape, followed ultimately by Qh8)
Humble to succeed at chess. Hummm. Oh ya, humble like…say…Kasarov, Fisher, Karpov, Topalov, etc., etc. I think humility in chess died somewhere back in Capablanca’s day. But that “We Surrender” blast was pretty darn funny…some people need to get over themselves and their inflated egos. It is a game after all…
Fischer, Kasparov and Karpov all have in common that on the road of becoming a World Champion they all were quite aware that they needed to improve on a lot of area’s.
In order to improve your chess, you will need to be open about yourself to yourself. Acknowledging that you have weaknesses/problems is really hard (we always need someone else to say it to us e.g Susan, Dr Phil, Oprah)but it’s the only way to improve.
So when I see someone rambling about his successes or bragging about solving puzzles, my first hunch is that he’s a fraud.
I agree with Nap Pogi:
I think Nf5 followed by Re1 finishes the game – and I found this in seconds – idea is to hinder the escape of the king
“In order to improve your chess, you will need to be open about yourself to yourself. Acknowledging that you have weaknesses/problems is really hard (we always need someone else to say it to us e.g Susan, Dr Phil, Oprah)but it’s the only way to improve.
So when I see someone rambling about his successes or bragging about solving puzzles, my first hunch is that he’s a fraud.”
Ok, fair enough. I’ll grant you that line of reasoning.
I wonder which exercises work best for improving visualisation and especially the ability to recall positions in your head. I assume that those are my biggest weaknesses at this point.
I tried solving puzzles purely in my head but that doesn’t work at all. It takes me longer to remember the position than to solve it…
So far I’ve never been able to accurately think about a position when I’m not sitting at the board, which really sucks. I can’t get a clear picture of the board in my head.
This JIm MD is very long-winded, although I confess I didn’t read anything but his first post. Susan usually says not to use a computer, but not on this one.
JImmd is great, although he’s so busy he can’t remember to put an apostrophe in the word “I’m.” Rather annoying.
that’s all man 🙂 just love to talk about chess………no bragging going on here 🙂
i do have a position that just so happened to occur in one of my games. id like to show it to you guys and see if you can come up with the plan or if your program can. i only have fritz 8 program and it doesnt come up with the best plan to follow thru with the attack. i think the calculation of the main variation is beyond its horizon slightly.
Paul Truong was obviously here 🙂
what makes you think Paul Truong was here? Ive met Paul in person.
🙂
because 🙂 Paul is obviously 🙂 covering posts for 🙂 Susan 🙂 while she is 🙂 bizy 🙂
f5
i think white Pf5 open up some nice possiblities. if black responds Pxf5 then white Nxf5 centralises knight and opens up some good attacking options. if black responds Pe5 then then the exchange white Pxe5 will threaten the pawn wall black has around his king.